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Balance Updates

K

krrios

Guest
Balance Updates

After analyzing the last change to spell damage, something unanticipated cropped up. Our resist chance algorithm is unique in that the chance to resist a spell depends on the damage, not circle, of that spell. This is entirely by design. Due, however, to the linear nature in spell damage, I chose a small 'range' value in the algorithm. Ultimately, that meant that even a small change in damage could result in a large change in resist chance.

To counteract this, I've analyzed a modified version of the resist algorithm. Instead of using a linear damage focus and small range, it uses an exponential function to decrease damage focus fluctuation at high values, and consequently allows a larger range value to be used.

I've written a program to compare three spell damage algorithms: our original, before the first change; our current, after the first change (what we have right now); and a proposed new change.

In addition to changing the resist algorithm, the proposed new algorithm also has slightly increased base damage for circle 1-3 and 5. Circle 5 listed here is given as damage for mindblasting an opponent who has their highest stat at 100 and lowest stat at 25.

Code:
######################################################################
# Original Algorithm:  # Current Algorithm:   # Proposed Algorithm:  #
# ---------            # ---------            # ---------            #
# Old Damage           # Current Damage       # Proposed Damage      #
# Current Resist       # Current Resist       # Proposed Resist      #
######################################################################
# Circle #1:           # Circle #1:           # Circle #1:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 8.00       #     Full: 8.00       #     Full: 10.00      #
# Resisted: 4.33       # Resisted: 4.39       # Resisted: 5.61       #
#   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 80.63%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 3 11.11%   #      Min: 1 2.78%    #      Min: 3 8.33%    #
#      Avg: 4.33       #      Avg: 4.39       #      Avg: 6.58       #
#      Max: 6 11.11%   #      Max: 7 8.33%    #      Max: 15 1.19%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #2:           # Circle #2:           # Circle #2:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 14.00      #     Full: 11.00      #     Full: 13.00      #
# Resisted: 8.00       # Resisted: 6.19       # Resisted: 7.39       #
#   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 66.14%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 7 33.33%   #      Min: 3 2.78%    #      Min: 4 2.56%    #
#      Avg: 8.00       #      Avg: 6.19       #      Avg: 9.40       #
#      Max: 9 33.33%   #      Max: 9 8.33%    #      Max: 18 1.50%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #3:           # Circle #3:           # Circle #3:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 18.00      #     Full: 15.00      #     Full: 16.00      #
# Resisted: 10.33      # Resisted: 8.61       # Resisted: 9.19       #
#   Chance: 91.07%     #   Chance: 97.56%     #   Chance: 53.75%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 9 11.11%   #      Min: 6 8.33%    #      Min: 6 2.08%    #
#      Avg: 11.04      #      Avg: 8.80       #      Avg: 12.43      #
#      Max: 20 2.09%   #      Max: 20 0.52%   #      Max: 21 1.74%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #4:           # Circle #4:           # Circle #4:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 22.00      #     Full: 19.00      #     Full: 19.00      #
# Resisted: 12.78      # Resisted: 11.00      # Resisted: 11.00      #
#   Chance: 72.36%     #   Chance: 85.81%     #   Chance: 43.63%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 12 26.24%  #      Min: 8 2.78%    #      Min: 8 1.69%    #
#      Avg: 15.36      #      Avg: 12.24      #      Avg: 15.58      #
#      Max: 24 4.17%   #      Max: 24 1.04%   #      Max: 24 1.93%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #5:           # Circle #5:           # Circle #5:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 27.00      #     Full: 27.00      #     Full: 29.00      #
# Resisted: 15.78      # Resisted: 15.81      # Resisted: 17.00      #
#   Chance: 48.90%     #   Chance: 48.89%     #   Chance: 21.89%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 15 18.46%  #      Min: 13 5.76%   #      Min: 14 0.85%   #
#      Avg: 21.54      #      Avg: 21.64      #      Avg: 26.41      #
#      Max: 29 6.67%   #      Max: 32 2.08%   #      Max: 34 2.35%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #6:           # Circle #6:           # Circle #6:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 32.00      #     Full: 29.00      #     Full: 29.00      #
# Resisted: 18.78      # Resisted: 17.00      # Resisted: 17.00      #
#   Chance: 25.43%     #   Chance: 39.56%     #   Chance: 21.89%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 18 10.56%  #      Min: 14 1.74%   #      Min: 14 0.85%   #
#      Avg: 28.67      #      Avg: 24.37      #      Avg: 26.41      #
#      Max: 34 9.30%   #      Max: 34 2.33%   #      Max: 34 2.35%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #7:           # Circle #7:           # Circle #7:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 40.00      #     Full: 37.00      #     Full: 37.00      #
# Resisted: 23.67      # Resisted: 21.81      # Resisted: 21.81      #
#   Chance: 12.50%     #   Chance: 13.65%     #   Chance: 12.75%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 22 1.39%   #      Min: 19 1.88%   #      Min: 19 1.40%   #
#      Avg: 37.96      #      Avg: 34.94      #      Avg: 35.08      #
#      Max: 42 9.72%   #      Max: 42 2.43%   #      Max: 42 2.50%   #
######################################################################

All values in this table are assuming that the attackers magery and evalint, and the defenders magic resist, are 100. Before this change is finalized, I will look at various other skill values, and make any adjustments as needed.


Summary
  • The changes two nights ago increased resist chance significantly. While the overall average damage only decreased by a relatively small amount, there were significantly more resisted spells, resulting in a greater perceived randomness in damage. Basically, it's become a lot harder to pull off a solid, strong combo.

  • The proposed changes generally decrease the chance to resist a spell. So, while spell damage is still slightly reduced from the original, players are still able to deal strong combos much of the time.

  • The proposed changes increase the effectiveness of smaller spells--magic arrow, harm, fireball, and lightning--to a level greater than or equal to that before the first balance update.

  • The proposed changes increase the effectiveness of mindblast against unbalanced opponents.

  • The proposed changes put sixth and eventh circle spells--energy bolt, explosion, and flamestrike--at an average damage square in the middle between what they were originally, and what they were after the last patch. Again, however, the resist chance has been tweaked, and so there will be more full, unresisted combos. This ultimately will result in a greater feel of consistancy between damage.


Questions and comments welcome.
 

jibah

Wanderer
Re: Balance Updates

While I don't understand a thing you just said, I have complete faith in you that it's good.
 

mdwright

Wanderer
Re: Balance Updates

So basically, spells will still be doing less damage but will be harder to resist than what it was originally?

Edit: Except 7ths, they're slightly easier to resist now?
 

Flipper

Knight
Re: Balance Updates

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 198 (62 members and 136 guests)

hi guys
 

Pepsi_Rox

Knight
Re: Balance Updates

krrios said:
After analyzing the last change to spell damage, something unanticipated cropped up. Our resist chance algorithm is unique in that the chance to resist a spell depends on the damage, not circle, of that spell. This is entirely by design. Due, however, to the linear nature in spell damage, I chose a small 'range' value in the algorithm. Ultimately, that meant that even a small change in damage could result in a large change in resist chance.

To counteract this, I've analyzed a modified version of the resist algorithm. Instead of using a linear damage focus and small range, it uses an exponential function to decrease damage focus fluctuation at high values, and consequently allows a larger range value to be used.

I've written a program to compare three spell damage algorithms: our original, before the first change; our current, after the first change (what we have right now); and a proposed new change.

In addition to changing the resist algorithm, the proposed new algorithm also has slightly increased base damage for circle 1-3 and 5. Circle 5 listed here is given as damage for mindblasting an opponent who has their highest stat at 100 and lowest stat at 25.

Code:
######################################################################
# Original Algorithm:  # Current Algorithm:   # Proposed Algorithm:  #
# ---------            # ---------            # ---------            #
# Old Damage           # Current Damage       # Proposed Damage      #
# Current Resist       # Current Resist       # Proposed Resist      #
######################################################################
# Circle #1:           # Circle #1:           # Circle #1:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 8.00       #     Full: 8.00       #     Full: 10.00      #
# Resisted: 4.33       # Resisted: 4.39       # Resisted: 5.61       #
#   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 80.63%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 3 11.11%   #      Min: 1 2.78%    #      Min: 3 8.33%    #
#      Avg: 4.33       #      Avg: 4.39       #      Avg: 6.58       #
#      Max: 6 11.11%   #      Max: 7 8.33%    #      Max: 15 1.19%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #2:           # Circle #2:           # Circle #2:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 14.00      #     Full: 11.00      #     Full: 13.00      #
# Resisted: 8.00       # Resisted: 6.19       # Resisted: 7.39       #
#   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 66.14%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 7 33.33%   #      Min: 3 2.78%    #      Min: 4 2.56%    #
#      Avg: 8.00       #      Avg: 6.19       #      Avg: 9.40       #
#      Max: 9 33.33%   #      Max: 9 8.33%    #      Max: 18 1.50%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #3:           # Circle #3:           # Circle #3:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 18.00      #     Full: 15.00      #     Full: 16.00      #
# Resisted: 10.33      # Resisted: 8.61       # Resisted: 9.19       #
#   Chance: 91.07%     #   Chance: 97.56%     #   Chance: 53.75%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 9 11.11%   #      Min: 6 8.33%    #      Min: 6 2.08%    #
#      Avg: 11.04      #      Avg: 8.80       #      Avg: 12.43      #
#      Max: 20 2.09%   #      Max: 20 0.52%   #      Max: 21 1.74%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #4:           # Circle #4:           # Circle #4:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 22.00      #     Full: 19.00      #     Full: 19.00      #
# Resisted: 12.78      # Resisted: 11.00      # Resisted: 11.00      #
#   Chance: 72.36%     #   Chance: 85.81%     #   Chance: 43.63%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 12 26.24%  #      Min: 8 2.78%    #      Min: 8 1.69%    #
#      Avg: 15.36      #      Avg: 12.24      #      Avg: 15.58      #
#      Max: 24 4.17%   #      Max: 24 1.04%   #      Max: 24 1.93%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #5:           # Circle #5:           # Circle #5:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 27.00      #     Full: 27.00      #     Full: 29.00      #
# Resisted: 15.78      # Resisted: 15.81      # Resisted: 17.00      #
#   Chance: 48.90%     #   Chance: 48.89%     #   Chance: 21.89%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 15 18.46%  #      Min: 13 5.76%   #      Min: 14 0.85%   #
#      Avg: 21.54      #      Avg: 21.64      #      Avg: 26.41      #
#      Max: 29 6.67%   #      Max: 32 2.08%   #      Max: 34 2.35%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #6:           # Circle #6:           # Circle #6:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 32.00      #     Full: 29.00      #     Full: 29.00      #
# Resisted: 18.78      # Resisted: 17.00      # Resisted: 17.00      #
#   Chance: 25.43%     #   Chance: 39.56%     #   Chance: 21.89%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 18 10.56%  #      Min: 14 1.74%   #      Min: 14 0.85%   #
#      Avg: 28.67      #      Avg: 24.37      #      Avg: 26.41      #
#      Max: 34 9.30%   #      Max: 34 2.33%   #      Max: 34 2.35%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #7:           # Circle #7:           # Circle #7:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 40.00      #     Full: 37.00      #     Full: 37.00      #
# Resisted: 23.67      # Resisted: 21.81      # Resisted: 21.81      #
#   Chance: 12.50%     #   Chance: 13.65%     #   Chance: 12.75%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 22 1.39%   #      Min: 19 1.88%   #      Min: 19 1.40%   #
#      Avg: 37.96      #      Avg: 34.94      #      Avg: 35.08      #
#      Max: 42 9.72%   #      Max: 42 2.43%   #      Max: 42 2.50%   #
######################################################################

All values in this table are assuming that the attackers magery and evalint, and the defenders magic resist, are 100. Before this change is finalized, I will look at various other skill values, and make any adjustments as needed.

Questions and comments welcome.

oh okay
 

fattybear

Traveler
Re: Balance Updates

Please put this in a nutshell. Basically mage damage will be better than the most recent changes, but not quite as much as before the changes?
 

Flipper

Knight
Re: Balance Updates

I think that's what he's saying, I'd personally like to see damage up a bit so that expl/eb x2 will kill someone no matter what, ie you can't mini heal through a perfect sync.
 

PooSlap

Wanderer
Re: Balance Updates

Im glad you posted the algorithm but I think its fine the way it is now. I realize the difference now.. I agree with the mind blasting deal and lower circles doing more damage but Im not sure your resist chance algorithm should be changed as you propose. Though I see your statistics.. I don't quite understand the "decrease damage focus fluctuation". I'd have to stare at the code to completely understand but based on the facts of the stuff you show I think your algorithm reduces the chance to resist too much. This may be my two gold pieces but whatever.

Im a lot happier with the spell damage right now.

Ophidian

krrios said:
After analyzing the last change to spell damage, something unanticipated cropped up. Our resist chance algorithm is unique in that the chance to resist a spell depends on the damage, not circle, of that spell. This is entirely by design. Due, however, to the linear nature in spell damage, I chose a small 'range' value in the algorithm. Ultimately, that meant that even a small change in damage could result in a large change in resist chance.

To counteract this, I've analyzed a modified version of the resist algorithm. Instead of using a linear damage focus and small range, it uses an exponential function to decrease damage focus fluctuation at high values, and consequently allows a larger range value to be used.

I've written a program to compare three spell damage algorithms: our original, before the first change; our current, after the first change (what we have right now); and a proposed new change.

In addition to changing the resist algorithm, the proposed new algorithm also has slightly increased base damage for circle 1-3 and 5. Circle 5 listed here is given as damage for mindblasting an opponent who has their highest stat at 100 and lowest stat at 25.

Code:
######################################################################
# Original Algorithm:  # Current Algorithm:   # Proposed Algorithm:  #
# ---------            # ---------            # ---------            #
# Old Damage           # Current Damage       # Proposed Damage      #
# Current Resist       # Current Resist       # Proposed Resist      #
######################################################################
# Circle #1:           # Circle #1:           # Circle #1:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 8.00       #     Full: 8.00       #     Full: 10.00      #
# Resisted: 4.33       # Resisted: 4.39       # Resisted: 5.61       #
#   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 80.63%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 3 11.11%   #      Min: 1 2.78%    #      Min: 3 8.33%    #
#      Avg: 4.33       #      Avg: 4.39       #      Avg: 6.58       #
#      Max: 6 11.11%   #      Max: 7 8.33%    #      Max: 15 1.19%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #2:           # Circle #2:           # Circle #2:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 14.00      #     Full: 11.00      #     Full: 13.00      #
# Resisted: 8.00       # Resisted: 6.19       # Resisted: 7.39       #
#   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 100.00%    #   Chance: 66.14%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 7 33.33%   #      Min: 3 2.78%    #      Min: 4 2.56%    #
#      Avg: 8.00       #      Avg: 6.19       #      Avg: 9.40       #
#      Max: 9 33.33%   #      Max: 9 8.33%    #      Max: 18 1.50%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #3:           # Circle #3:           # Circle #3:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 18.00      #     Full: 15.00      #     Full: 16.00      #
# Resisted: 10.33      # Resisted: 8.61       # Resisted: 9.19       #
#   Chance: 91.07%     #   Chance: 97.56%     #   Chance: 53.75%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 9 11.11%   #      Min: 6 8.33%    #      Min: 6 2.08%    #
#      Avg: 11.04      #      Avg: 8.80       #      Avg: 12.43      #
#      Max: 20 2.09%   #      Max: 20 0.52%   #      Max: 21 1.74%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #4:           # Circle #4:           # Circle #4:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 22.00      #     Full: 19.00      #     Full: 19.00      #
# Resisted: 12.78      # Resisted: 11.00      # Resisted: 11.00      #
#   Chance: 72.36%     #   Chance: 85.81%     #   Chance: 43.63%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 12 26.24%  #      Min: 8 2.78%    #      Min: 8 1.69%    #
#      Avg: 15.36      #      Avg: 12.24      #      Avg: 15.58      #
#      Max: 24 4.17%   #      Max: 24 1.04%   #      Max: 24 1.93%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #5:           # Circle #5:           # Circle #5:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 27.00      #     Full: 27.00      #     Full: 29.00      #
# Resisted: 15.78      # Resisted: 15.81      # Resisted: 17.00      #
#   Chance: 48.90%     #   Chance: 48.89%     #   Chance: 21.89%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 15 18.46%  #      Min: 13 5.76%   #      Min: 14 0.85%   #
#      Avg: 21.54      #      Avg: 21.64      #      Avg: 26.41      #
#      Max: 29 6.67%   #      Max: 32 2.08%   #      Max: 34 2.35%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #6:           # Circle #6:           # Circle #6:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 32.00      #     Full: 29.00      #     Full: 29.00      #
# Resisted: 18.78      # Resisted: 17.00      # Resisted: 17.00      #
#   Chance: 25.43%     #   Chance: 39.56%     #   Chance: 21.89%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 18 10.56%  #      Min: 14 1.74%   #      Min: 14 0.85%   #
#      Avg: 28.67      #      Avg: 24.37      #      Avg: 26.41      #
#      Max: 34 9.30%   #      Max: 34 2.33%   #      Max: 34 2.35%   #
######################################################################
# Circle #7:           # Circle #7:           # Circle #7:           #
#                      #                      #                      #
#     Full: 40.00      #     Full: 37.00      #     Full: 37.00      #
# Resisted: 23.67      # Resisted: 21.81      # Resisted: 21.81      #
#   Chance: 12.50%     #   Chance: 13.65%     #   Chance: 12.75%     #
#                      #                      #                      #
#      Min: 22 1.39%   #      Min: 19 1.88%   #      Min: 19 1.40%   #
#      Avg: 37.96      #      Avg: 34.94      #      Avg: 35.08      #
#      Max: 42 9.72%   #      Max: 42 2.43%   #      Max: 42 2.50%   #
######################################################################

All values in this table are assuming that the attackers magery and evalint, and the defenders magic resist, are 100. Before this change is finalized, I will look at various other skill values, and make any adjustments as needed.

Questions and comments welcome.
 
K

krrios

Guest
Re: Balance Updates

I've updated my post with a summary of the changes.
 
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